Exodus and Slayer guitarist Gary Holt talks about his new memoir
Bay Area thrash-metal guitar hero Gary Holt recently talked to CBS News Bay Area about his new memoir "A Fabulous Disaster: From the Garage to Madison Square Garden, the Hard Way," his upcoming plans for Exodus and his return to the stage with Slayer.
A member of pioneering East Bay thrash-metal outfit Exodus for over four decades, Holt has been the principle creative force behind the band's signature neck-snapping riffs for most of its existence. The group was formed in 1979 by guitarist Kirk Hammett and drummer Tom Hunting when they were just teenagers, initially playing AC/DC, Scorpions and Judas Priest covers at backyard parties and rented halls before graduating to writing original songs and performing at Bay Area clubs.
The band went through a number of line-up changes before the quintet made two key additions in 1981 with guitarist Holt and wildman vocalist Paul Baloff joining the fold as new Exodus songs began to take a more aggressive, punk-influenced direction. The crew played its first ever San Francisco show at the Old Waldorf in late November of 1982, an event made even more momentous by being the band's first encounter with then LA-based group Metallica, who were the headliners. Just a few months later in April, Metallica poached Hammett to replace troubled guitar player Dave Mustaine for the recording of the band's debut album Kill 'Em All.
Hammett would essentially hand the reigns of Exodus over to Holt, who wrote a bulk of the music and lyrics for the band's seminal debut Bonded By Blood with assists from new guitarist Rick Hunolt, Baloff and Hunting before it was recorded in the summer 1984. Powered by such brutal mosh-pit anthems as "And Then There Were None," "Strike of the Beast" and the pulverizing title track, the recording would have been one of the first salvos of the growing Bay Area thrash-metal movement if the album's release hadn't been delayed by label issues until the spring of 1985.
Still, thanks to underground success of the raw recording and the band's growing reputation for ferocious live shows, Exodus was soon being courted by major labels trying to tap into the emerging popularity of thrash. The band parted ways with Baloff after the Bonded By Blood tour, replacing him with Steve "Zetro" Souza, the singer who had made his name fronting another East Bay metal band Legacy (who would soon rename themselves Testament).
Signed to Sony/Combat Records, Exodus hit its commercial peak with 1987's Pleasures of the Flesh and Fabulous Disaster two years later, continuing to set the bar for sonic brutality high while earning a broader audience thanks to MTV airplay of the hit "The Toxic Waltz" from the latter album.
The group would hit a rough patch after moving to Capitol Records for 1989's Impact is Imminent following the departure of Hunting due to crippling anxiety attacks before performances. Holt would put Exodus on hiatus in the early '90s after issuing the slower, more experimental Force of Habit in 1992, but the band reunited with Baloff and new bassist Jack Gibson later in the decade for a live album and periodic touring. It wasn't until after Baloff passed away in 2002 from a stroke that Souza would return to the fold, recording 2004's Tempo of the Damned before a sudden and acrimonious split from Exodus that same year.
The band spent much of the next decade producing recordings featuring new singer Rob Dukes and former Heathen guitarist Lee Altus. The acclaimed albums including a re-recording of Bonded By Blood entitled Let There Be Blood in 2008, but more notable were the ambitious efforts The Atrocity Exhibition... Exhibit A and Exhibit B: The Human Condition that shifted the band's songwriting to more intricate and complex, multi-part thrash epics. While the busy Holt split his time filling in onstage for ailing Slayer guitarist Jeff Hanneman starting in 2011 -- Hanneman sadly died two years later -- Exodus remained his main passion.
In 2014, the band made surprise announcement that it had parted ways with Dukes after a decade, with Souza once again returning to Exodus as lead singer. Though some fans expressed skepticism over the change, their Nuclear Blast Records release Blood In, Blood Out that year was widely hailed as a punishing return to form.
Exodus maintained a busy touring schedule since that album was released, despite the fact that Holt was busy for a solid stretch of 2018 and 2019 with Slayer's global farewell tour. Still, the band managed to write enough new songs to enter the studio to record their latest effort (and first album in seven years) Persona Non Grata during late summer of 2020 at Hunting's home studio near Lake Almanor.
While the band had planned to release the album sooner, another health issue besides the pandemic would force them to change plans. In the spring of 2021, Hunting announced that he had been diagnosed with squamous cell carcinoma (SCC) of the stomach. In addition to a regimen of chemotherapy to treat the cancer, this summer he was forced to undergo a full gastrectomy and spent several months recovering from that operation and adjusting to living life without a stomach.
Hunting was happily able to return to the stage for Exodus' appearance at Aftershock in Sacramento in the fall of 2021 as well as the Oakland stop of "The Bay Strikes Back Tour" on the Thanksgiving holiday weekend. Persona Non Grata finally saw release around that time to reviews that hailed the band for delivering such a brutal feast of riffs more than 40 years after it was founded. Last year, Exodus announced it was parting ways with Nuclear Blast after 20 years on the label to sign with Napalm Records.
While the band's next studio album is already in the works, last May they released a new archival live recording from 35 years earlier. British Disaster: The Battle of '89 (Live at the Astoria) finds Exodus delivering a blistering set during its Fabulous Disaster tour that captured the early Souza-fronted line-up at the height of its powers. The band also released a cover of the AC/DC song "Beatin' Around the Bush" that was recorded during the Persona Non Grata sessions.
Fans got another surprise earlier this year when Exodus announced that they were once again parting ways with Souza, with Dukes returning to the line-up to record the forthcoming new songs for not one but two new albums that are in the works. Holt also just published his compelling memoir entitled "A Fabulous Disaster: From the Garage to Madison Square Garden, the Hard Way," which came out on Hatchette Books April 1st. Chronicling his colorful adventures (and misadventures with the law) as a teen growing up in San Pablo, his career playing with Exodus and Slayer and his struggles with addiction, the book offers an alternately hilarious and harrowing look behind the scenes at Holt's life as one of the most important creative forces in American thrash metal.
In addition to recording new songs, the band is set to take to the road with Dukes, playing two special shows celebrating the 40th anniversary of Bonded By Blood with the band delivering the album in its entirety in Berkeley at the UC Theatre -- a sold-out concert that actually falls on what would have been Baloff's birthday and will be available to livestream -- and the House of Blues in Anaheim with support from fellow thrash veterans Death Angel, Blind Illusion, Hirax and Nukem. The band will then embark on a tour across the U.S. playing headlining dates with Havok and Misfire in addition to several appearances at metal festivals in Ohio, Florida and Wisconsin. The group played its first show with Dukes singing on April 4 when Exodus topped the Saturday bill of the two-day Decibel Magazing Metal & Beer Fest in Philadelphia. Coincidentally, Slayer has just announced its only North American headlining show this year with an all-day stadium festival at Hersheypark Stadium in September that will include Exodus as one of the support acts.
This interview has been edited for length and clarity.
CBS SF: Did you look at writing the book as something of a collaboration with your co-author and editor similar to when you're working on songs with the other members of Exodus, in that it was your vision and you had the final say, but there was still some outside input involved?
Gary Holt: With the book, when we turned it in -- myself and my co-writer, Adem Tepedelen -- and they changed nothing. They might have edited a couple words here and there for flow and things like that. And we had a Zoom meeting with the legal department. There were some times when they said, "Well, we better leave that name out," because someone might come back and, you know, decide to sue over being dragged through the mud. But in the end, the only person I really dragged through the mud was myself, and I'm not going to sue myself. So that was all good.
I've had offers and inquiries about doing a book about my story for a long time, and I always wanted to do it. I wanted to write it entirely myself. Time becomes a real issue, when you're constantly working and having to write records and stuff as well. The band did a Decibel cover story with Adem as the writer, and he asked me about it, and I said, "Alright, we'll give it a shot." Because I think the most crucial point is being comfortable with the guy you're talking to, you know? You're pulling a lot of scabs off. And with Adem, I totally felt that way. We would have countless conversations, just retelling stories starting from the beginning, and it worked out famously.
CBS SF: I was going to ask how you connected with him for the book, but it sounds like you had a basis to work from and that he was sort of an instigator too, as far as someone who was interested in your story...
Gary Holt: Yeah, and it was just a perfect partnership. We're really close friends now. And I would give him notes, like one word, or phrases with two or three words, that would immediately remind me of entire wild stories. They're just the way Exodus have referred to some of these stories. So Adem would just read off this list, and two words would like lead to an entire incident. But that's just the way Exodus has always remembered things, with phrases and nicknames.
CBS SF: Despite the volume of drugs and alcohol you talk about going through like, dating back to when you were a teen, your recollections even dating back to the '80s are pretty vivid. Is there anything you attribute to the clarity of those memories?
Gary Holt: I've always had a really sharp memory. Obviously there's moments in one's life when you partied as hard as I have, of course you're not going to remember; when you're black-out drunk. But usually there's someone there to tell you what you did, so you still have a memory of that. But I've always had a good memory of things and dates and incidents. And I have a vast photo collection from the days prior to digital photographs, when you'd roll into a town and a fan would give you 75 photos they took from the last time you were there. And I can look at those photos and still tell you where they are, you know? Like, "Oh, those are Cleveland" or whatever. A lot of the guys in Exodus like Steve Souza, our now former singer, he's got an even better memory than I do.
CBS SF: You're really blunt about the struggles with drugs that you had, but by extension there's also a lot of details that sort of get into your bandmates' similar struggles. Did you have to talk with Tom and Rick or other people whose past habits you touch on to sort of get the OK to get into that?
Gary Holt: Yeah, absolutely. And none of us have made any secret about our own past. It's not like, "I was spun out on crank and no one knew the other guys were." Everybody knew we were. As a matter of fact, I was the guy who had more people fooled. I noticed that when we did the 1997 live album with Paul Baloff, it was a big deal in the Bay Area and journalists flew in from all over. I was doing an interview with someone from Europe, and the guy goes, "You know, they call me Doctor Honest!" I'm like, "Okay, Doctor Honest, shoot!" And he goes, "Well, from what I heard this guy and this guy are really out of it and have bad drug problems, and you're not." Maybe at the time I wasn't bad, but I was using. I was probably high at the moment the guy was interviewing me. I think I was able to get away with it longer, until it was at the point where we're just all tweakers, you know?
CBS SF: In some ways, you can see that it was part of the culture of the band in that there was a social aspect to it early on, but later everyone sort of drifted off and was doing drugs by themselves and struggling with those demons on their own.
Gary Holt: Yeah, exactly. Like in their early '80s, we would get a little bag of speed, and it just kept us up to drink longer, and we partied hard. And that little bag would become a one-person amount many years later. I think the thing I'm most proud of is that we're all clean. Not just myself. We're all living our best lives right now. We're survivors, this band. We're like cockroaches. You can't kill us [laughs].
Well, I mean, no. I should take that back, you know? Baloff. I talk about that in the book. It took me quite a while after Paul's death to come to grips with my own problems. They actually intensified after that. The thing with Paul Baloff, there was such a mystery about him and his life. And it was after his death we found out that one parent died of a stroke and the other had a heart attack. He was predisposed for this to begin with.
CBS SF: And additionally predisposed given his lifestyle...
Gary Holt: Exactly. It certainly didn't help. I went further into the spiral after he died. It took a while for me to wake up.
CBS SF: It was funny to hear about some of the parts of the Baloff mythology that you learned weren't necessarily true after he died...
Gary Holt: People come up with these stories that he told them and I'm like, "You gotta be kidding me!" Things I didn't know. I fully believed he had emigrated from Russia. He was born at Highland Hospital in Oakland [laughs]! He was larger than life and a scene legend, and he was a wonderful person. I mean, yeah, he could smash things and break things and become a total nuisance, but we all were.
CBS SF: I learned just a few days ago from a friend that the word recently got out that you are working on two albums. Where are you with recording? I'm guessing, especially with the singer switch, that Rob is just sort of starting to get acquainted with some of the stuff you've written?
Gary Holt: It's just started, because we don't ever stop the creative process. When we're in the studio now, we leave the drum set up the whole time. In the old days, you'd track drums first, and when they were done, the drums would go away. Now we leave them there, and if I write a new song four or five weeks in, we go and record it.
Lee [Altus] has been wildly creative on this one. We looked at the number of songs we had and we're really close to having a second album worth of material. And it's all great. It's not like, "Oh, here's the record, and these songs are good too." We're like, "Let's just keep working!" We're not getting any younger. And when we get to that point after a tour cycle for the new album, we'll have an album ready to go.
I'm certain that come that time, I'll have something new that has to be on the record. "Listen to this one!" But then we go in the studio for two weeks, not two months, you know? We can add to it. Right now, we're at 16 songs with another four in the works that I'm going to finish. Ten songs per album, we're there.
The crazy thing is -- my wife will tell me I'm nuts -- but I've started thinking about mortality at 60 years old. What if something happened to me between now and then? I have a album to that can be released; Gary Holt and Exodus' final work together. Prince has a vault of material. I don't quite have a vault, but I'm going to try my hardest to keep writing. And then maybe, between album cycles when we have an album finished, I can finally have a vacation for the first time in my life. One that doesn't require me to play guitar to get to. I've never had one of those. I've never gotten on a plane to Hawaii or Jamaica or the Bahamas or anything without gear. I mean, I've played and maybe I got to spend an afternoon somewhere. Maybe in the future. I think I deserve it.
CBS SF: So at this early stage, you're probably not thinking about which songs will actually make up this first album? That's all something to be figured out once stuff is closer to completion?
Gary Holt: Yeah, when it gets more fleshed out. Right now we've started on bass and rhythm guitars, and I'm writing lyrics, and Tom's writing lyrics, and Rob's writing lyrics. So when we get to that point, we'll figure out what makes the best album. And then the other songs will remain for the next one. And, like I said, I'm certain by the time [the next album] rolls around, I'll want to add to it. But for all intents and purposes, we'll have it finished, you know?
CBS SF: In the book, you talk about the reluctance and regret involved with Rob Dukes being asked to leave during the recording of Blood In Blood Out. Was there any thought of even considering a different singer with the band parting ways with Zetro?
Gary Holt: You mean now? No. I don't like change, for one. I never intended to make any of these vocalist changes. Not Rob the first time, and not Steve [now]. But at 60 years old, all of us, we all demand to be happy and be surrounded by happiness. We did some amazing music with Steve back. Amazing. Persona Non Grata is my second favorite album in our whole catalog.
But we're moving forward. I didn't want to bring in a young guy. Yeah, we could have brought in some 30-year-old guy who's young and has abs and can still jump off drum risers [laughs]. That sounds appealing, but I like familiarity. Rob keeps me laughing, and he's an amazing singer. And he's one of my best friends. So that was kind of a no brainer. I mean, I don't know how much longer we could play this kind of ferocious stuff. Over the years, we've just gotten faster and the songs have gotten harder to play as the arthritis gets worse. So we're going to just keep going for it as long as we can.
CBS SF: I didn't want to get into Steve's departure too much. You've talked about it, and he's talked about it. But I did find it interesting that in the book, you talk about you guys being at the best place that you'd been in your whole career. So there was definitely some change between when you were writing the final chapters in the book and now...
Gary Holt: It was, until it wasn't. It's one of those things. And I've got nothing but love for him. It's not like the last time he left the band, when it was on really bad terms. At 60 years old, this job gets f--king hard. And if you don't like to travel, and no longer like to be out on the road and and you want to cut the touring way back and all that, we can no longer make a living at this. We literally would have to go get day jobs. That's pretty much what happened. One guy wasn't enjoying it anymore.
And none of us enjoy being away from home all the time. It sucks. My happy place is being around my family. I can speak for all of us, Steve included. But while I can -- this whole age thing -- while I can still tour for six weeks and crush it and go out and play seven, eight, nine shows in a row, I'm going to do it. Until I can't, and then I'll slow down. But if we start slowing down now, eventually it's just going to come to a stop.
CBS SF: I also thought that it was interesting that, even in this time of division and animosity in the world of politics, that when you made the announcement, for a minute on the Internet it seemed like there was nothing in the world more controversial than Exodus changing singers. I was curious about your take on that. I mean, on one hand it's good that people care enough about Exodus to get in really heated debates on the subject...
Gary Holt: Yeah, and I get it, because they're both integral parts of the history of this band, Zetro through the whole '80s and Rob through the modern era. People need to understand: I never planned on this. I saw one guy online, like, 'It's all about the money.' Since when has parting ways with your singer from your glory days of the '80s and some amazing modern-era records ever been profitable? What the f--k are you talking about?
The same guy had written down this timeline of singers. And according to him, we fired Baloff the second time. When he died. Dude, he died! We didn't fire him! He wrote it all down. "Band founded with Baloff. Band fires Baloff. Band gets Steve Souza. Band fires Steve Souza." No, band broke up! "Band fires Baloff." No, he died. "Band fires Steve Souza." No, Steve quit the last time. We didn't fire him three times. We didn't fire Paul after he died. People are f--king stupid. Sorry. You just have to tune it out. None of this was pre-planned. None of it was done due to financial reasons.
CBS SF: Sometimes as a fan, you just have to let these things go. They happen. And nobody really knows what happened except the people in the band.
Gary Holt: In the past, in the early days of the Internet, someone angry -- myself included -- we'd just pop off and go on a rant. We're just keeping things internal. And like I said, I've got nothing but love for Steve. And I'm super proud of the work we've done together in the past: Tempo of the Damned and Blood In Blood Out, and especially Persona Non Grata, which he crushed. Crushed it! I just want to keep working. I just want to keep making fresh new albums. That's what I love doing.
CBS SF: I was going to bring up the example of Brent Hinds and Mastodon parting ways just recently. I've been a huge fan of the band since they first played San Francisco. I was like, "What? How is that going to work?" I have one friend who knows those guys and he was asking, "How do you replace a unicorn?"
Gary Holt: I'm really good friends with all those guys, and I have not asked a single one of them what happened. It's not my business. 25 year founding member, there's a reason there somewhere. It's not my place to ask. They're all friends, and I could text any one of them and ask, and I'm not going to.
CBS SF: One thing from the book that I really respected was your approach to playing with Slayer, that you were the hired hand and they were the band and they made the decisions...
Gary Holt: Exactly. And I've always been treated like family in the Slayer camp. I just show up and play guitar, which is the beauty of it. With Exodus, I have to wear so many hats. Slayer, I just shut up and play guitar. That's awesome. I love it. It takes so much pressure off. All I have to do is concentrate on playing.
CBS SF: The band has a headlining tour coming up with some festival dates, but first you have the special Bonded By Blood shows in Berkeley and Anaheim. I think they're both sold out?
Gary Holt: We sold it out in three weeks. It's crazy. It's the fastest we've ever sold a Bay Area show out, I think, in the history of this band. I firmly believed in these shows. That anniversary, on Paul's birthday on a Friday night? That's not going to happen all the time. With the agents and everybody, I was like, "We can do this. This is going to be an event." I wanted to do it at the Warfield, and they said, "No, you can't do the Warfield. It's not going to sell the tickets."
We just did the show at the UC Theater [in December]. First time I'd ever even been there. I'm like, "This place is great. Let's do it here then." And it sold out in three weeks, two months in advance. I think we could have sold another 1,000 tickets and played the Warfield or even the Fox. And the LA show at the House of Blues in Anaheim, that holds 1,900. Sold out. That's the biggest sell-out show we've ever booked in Southern California. I was right! This album's special. I said, "Don't discount this anniversary!" And it's not something we've done a bunch. I think we've advertised playing Bonded By Blood in its entirety once before, and that was years ago.
CBS SF: You also just announced some European dates in the summer with Sacred Reich?
Gary Holt: Just some small off-day shows. We're mostly playing festivals. I think they're doing like three shows. Maybe four.
CBS SF: There are also more live shows with Slayer. I know at least one performance that's part of the big festival in Birmingham for Black Sabbath's last show.
Gary Holt: We're returning to Louder Than Life. Last year's storm ended that one before it ever started. And there's a festival in Quebec. So I finish the Exodus tour and go straight to the UK for the Slayer stuff.
CBS SF: I regret not being able to make it to Aftershock in Sacramento last year. I did see the Slayer farewell shows in San Jose and Oakland and they were great, but couldn't pull off Aftershock.
Gary Holt: Aftershock was rad. It was special. We did not suck.
CBS SF: I heard great things about the Slayer set. And it was arguably the best Aftershock lineup ever.
Gary Holt: A hard one to top for sure.
CBS SF: Early in the book, you talk about the shows that you were seeing in the late '70s as a teen, including Days on the Green with AC/DC, UFO, Ted Nugent and Thin Lizzy. One band you singled out that sort of surprised me was Styx. What was it about that show that resonated with you so much?
Gary Holt: I was a little kid, for one. But "Miss America," that song rocks so hard! "Blue Collar Man." All these killer songs. They're still heroes of mine. I love that band! Phenomenal. I mean, the heyday, classic stuff. I'm not such a fan of the "Mr. Roboto" era. I could pass on that. But Grand Illusion? Pieces of Eight? Those are just insanely awesome records.
CBS SF: You also mention being a fan of Madonna and Prince. I actually knew about Prince, because you've talked about your admiration of him as a musician…
Gary Holt: Now, Prince is my musical hero, but I was a huge Madonna fan forever. The heyday stuff up to like Blonde Ambition era, it's just phenomenal. Just pop force. And Prince is the greatest musician there ever was, or ever will be. There'll never be another one like him.
CBS SF: I wholeheartedly agree with you. I saw him as much as I could, up through the last tour he did. I was like, "How is he going to play the Oakland Arena doing solo piano? This is ridiculous!"
Gary Holt: I wanted to see that one, but I was on tour myself when he did the "Piano and a Microphone Tour." I have huge regrets about missing that one, because my favorite thing that he ever did was play piano. I loved him as a piano player. I mean, he's the best guitar player in the world too. A great drummer, bass player, all of it. But I loved it when he played piano.
CBS SF: You also mention seeing Janet Jackson in the book when you're talking about the Slayer farewell tou. I'm guessing that that was probably an Oakland arena show?
Gary Holt: Yeah, that was the "Rhythm Nation Tour."
CBS SF: What are some other acts that Exodus fans would be surprised that you're a fan of?
Gary Holt: I listen to the most pop music of anybody in thrash. I love it. My radio in the car, it's either on KGO sports talk or it's on the local soft rock station. I love Adele. She's amazing. The Bangles. Terence Trent D'Arby is one of my heroes. Lisa Stansfield. I love that stuff.
